Wednesday 06/24/2015 by phishnet

BEST OF 1997 (15-11)

This week at Phish.Net, we're going to be counting down the twenty best shows of 1997, as decided by members of the Phish.Net team. If you're just tuning in, you may want to start with the Honorable Mentions and Shows 20-16 linked below. Now, without further ado, Shows 15-11 after the jump... [SP]

Previously:
Honorable Mentions
Shows 20-16

15. 8/10/97 Deer Creek Music Center, Noblesville, IN (Dan Mielcarz)

This show opens with a short but strong “Bathtub Gin” that veers into Type II territory at the end of the jam. “Down With Disease” is a pretty straightforward version leading into a very Set I sequence of “Dirt,” “CTB” and “Billy Breathes.” The “Split Open and Melt” that follows however, is phenomenal. An epic version, it contains a full-on “Larks’ Tongues in Aspic” jam and a re-emergence of the “SOAM” riff that kicks all kinds of ass. “Bye Bye Foot” is a pleasant novelty in this reviewer’s opinion, and “Ginseng Sullivan” one of my preferred bluegrass tunes (YMMV quite a bit on those two). But everyone can agree that the “Harry Hood” to end the set was a spectacularly beautiful version that capped off a pretty great Set I.

Set II starts off with what I believe to be the best “Cities” ever. An amazing journey into type II land, this “Cities” covers a lot of ground. Funk, rock, beautiful melodic playing, and a great segue into “Good Times, Bad Times.” A spectacular jam that secures this show’s spot in the top 20. Okay, so maybe the “Rotation Jam” into “Rock A William” isn’t exactly the strongest musical moment of 97, but give it some points for novelty (or don’t, which would put you in concert with most of our panel). The set-closing “David Bowie” is polarizing - some people (myself included) love the extended intro in which the band is screwing around with sound effects and pedals, faking out the audience, taking a quick journey into space, and seemingly having a great time, but other listeners take a dimmer view. If nothing else, Fishman should earn points for his ability to keep a beat on the hi-hat for as long as he does. “David Bowie” proper begins about 8 minutes in, and provides an explosive finish for one of the most interesting front-to-back sets of 1997.

14. 12/3/97 CoreStates Spectrum, Philadelphia, PA (Eric Wyman)

For any show to be considered great, in my opinion, the first set counts. Fall of 1997 is blessed with amazing first sets and this show is no exception. Any time you have three quality jams before the lights come back up, know you are in a special place. 12/3 puts forth the trifecta of “Drowned,” with another amazing funk journey, “Gumbo” > “2001,” a space-y transitional jam that slows the tempo of the set only to crash back in with the party anthem, and a set closing “You Enjoy Myself.” While this version probably sits last amongst the versions from previous shows in the tour, the string of YEM’s over this stretch are top notch.



12/3/97 Set II -- Philadelphia, PA

Having said that, there’s still that second set. 1997 is unique in that there are several occasions where the first set is analytically better and this show may just be one of those instances. And while the first set contains the memorable jams, the second is consistent. The set opening “David Bowie,” begins with the extended intro, rich with teases and anticipation, and blossoms into a very strong Type-II jam. Following the ensuing “Possum,” Trey kicks the band into an impromptu funk jam, which is an indicator of how much he enjoyed playing these riffs. Compositionally, it is no different than the other ‘jam(s)’ of the era and would have been significantly more impressive had it morphed directly from the “Possum,” but none of that can take away from the groove. Both the “Prince Caspian” and “Harry Hood” provide wonderful moments of bliss and the “Crossroads” encore signals a raucous conclusion to the evening. Certainly a great show, but lacks the brilliant fireworks found on other nights.

13. 8/17/97 Loring Commerce Centre, Limestone, ME (Jeremy D. Goodwin)

This legendary show is all about the second set, but that’s quite enough to land it solidly in the mid-table of the year’s best 20 shows. It’s essentially a non-stop love-a-thon between band and audience, and (arguably?) the moment when that relationship was first stated so explicitly from onstage. But that moment comes after an absolutely monster “Down With Disease” (a perfectly good call for best version of the year, and certainly one of the top three) and a spine-tingling “Bathtub Gin” (aka “the Went Gin”) with an intensely driving peak that holds a unique place among the gallery of classic upbeat Phish jams. The second version of “Also Sprach Zaranthustra” (following 8/13) to get taken for a ride at length provides a delirious dance sequence near the middle of the set, the ambient “Art Jam” offers an advance peak of the “Ring of Fire” set at Lemonwheel the next year, an epically poetic “Harry Hood” closes.



"Bathtub Gin" -- 8/17/97 Limestone, ME

Apparently spent, the band came out for the third set firing blanks (after a red-herring breakout of the ultra-rare "Buffalo Bill" to open the set), and the first set is really notable only for one of the U.S. tour’s only two “Tweezer”s and a delightful opener of “The Wedge.” But that second set is a candidate for greatest non-stop musical sequence of the year, and has remained an unforgettable listen. On its own, it provides enough highlights to outclass many of the year’s very good and excellent shows.

12. 12/2/97 CoreStates Spectrum, Philadelphia, PA (Brian Levine)

The virtual unanimity of love bestowed upon Phish’s 1997 fall tour makes it awfully difficult to argue that any of its 21 shows is underrated. At the very least, it would take somebody profoundly ignorant to make that claim of the 11th-ranked show (as of press time) in its equally-lauded year, right? If so—well, then consider me that ignoramus. Both nights of the ’97 Spectrum stand have been overshadowed by numerous other shows: Denver, Hampton, Winston-Salem, Auburn Hills, and Dayton to name a few. In the fourteen From the Archives shows, ten Live Bait volumes, and countless Live Phish releases since that tour, not even a single second of either Philly show has been included.

Unbeknownst at the time to the band or its fan base, night one at the Spectrum marked Phish’s 14th anniversary. An extremely enjoyable set one—featuring the first “Buried Alive” opener in over a year, the lone “DWD” -> “Makisupa” pairing to date, and yet another incendiary ’97 “Ghost” dance party—merely served as the opening act to one of Phish’s finest hours. I could go on babbling for days detailing the virtues of set two’s opening, 65-minute “Mike’s Groove,” but with his Jam Chart entry, @Icculus said it best and most succinctly: !@^#$!#$%^@#$#$!&$#*(^&%#@!$%&@#$!@*&*#$@!!!!!

11. 7/31/97 Shoreline Amphitheatre, Mountain View, CA (Dan Purcell)

This mild Thursday night at the Jamband Landfill ranks with the most generous and wall-to-wall outstanding full-show experiences of Phish’s career. Just like 1997 itself did, the show starts with a “Ghost,” creeping low-key urgency that lulls you to sleep and before you know it it’s changing keys on the fly and motoring aggressively to a big middle finger of a peak. The band was in no hurry, but they came for business. The ensuing “Ya Mar” would get insanely surpassed in Albany in December but it still has about 12 fake endings and a weird little Type II excursion before rattling to a standstill like a dying engine. “Limb by Limb” is extended and chaotic and the Italian suit-clad Jon Fishman is playing so good that he won’t let go of the beat at the end, prompting Trey to sing his praises afterward. There is some other outstanding content -- a hot “Maze” and 1997’s only “Glide” -- but the meat gets brought by the “YEM” set closer, which shows up an hour ten into the set. It’s the best “YEM” of the year without reasonable question; for God’s sake, even the dadgum vocal jam is worth hearing in its entirety.

The band was loose enough at the start of set two to do a short full-band tease of “Sweet Home Alabama,” which is hilariously tracked separately on the internet. The real set opener is a sprawling, patient “Runaway Jim” that goes 20-plus without getting boring. The middle of the set contains positive setlist choices like “Vultures” and “McGrupp,” both played very well, like everything at this show. The set-closing orthodox “Mike’s Groove” may just be a A-/B+ and is not in serious competition with Philly or even Raleigh, but for me it kicks the ass of many (great) versions from this (great) year, including Vegas and Alpine and the extremely dozy Hampton opener. They can’t play the “Cinnamon Girl” encore at all, but they’d just re-learned it during the three-minute encore break from a CD they’d sent Brad Sands out to pick up at setbreak.


Photo courtesy of Expressobeans.com

So why doesn’t it rank higher? As you might be able to guess, I personally think it should. I was at the show, so maybe that’s why. Other members of our panel disrespected the “Jim,” arguing it’s merely good not really a top-tier jam; some undervalued the “YEM.” Maybe this is part of our regular tendency to undervalue performers who are very good at everything but maybe not great at any single thing, Like the fact that Ozzie Smith is in the Hall of Fame but Lou Whitaker never got a sniff. Even if this show lacks the height of the Denver “Ghost” or the “Tweezabella,” it’s easily the widest show of the year.

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Comments

, comment by therealburnham
therealburnham Wow I really thought that second night second set from the Great Went would carry it higher but I guess that's really a testament to how great 1997 is on a whole. Still hoping for 6/25/97 to show up eventually here...
, comment by therealburnham
therealburnham I just realized that the Lille France show isn't even in the top 20 of the year so it's unlikely. That makes me sad. I guess the first set isn't quite good enough.
, comment by n00b100
n00b100 My guess for what the last 10 shows will be, in order:

1. 12/30/97
2. 11/17/97
3. 11/22/97
4. 12/6/97
5. 7/2/97
6. 11/23/97
7. 7/30/97
8. 12/11/97
9. 7/22/97
10. 11/21/97

Wouldn't be shocked to see 11/19/97 on here, too.
, comment by Choda
Choda Wow. This is turning anti-climatic.
, comment by Dressed_In_Gray
Dressed_In_Gray @n00b100 said:

Wouldn't be shocked to see 11/19/97 on here, too.
I would. If it is the Top 10, I will be shocked. No way it deserves to be higher than either night of the Went
, comment by bl002e
bl002e @Choda said:
Wow. This is turning anti-climatic.
Man, will your face be red when you find out which show placed #1.

[Spoiler]
Hint: It rhymes with "'Pour me wine,' we state."
, comment by MiguelSanchez
MiguelSanchez That's a pretty agreeable list today. I'm glad to see the Deer Creek show make the cut. Say what you will about the rest of the show, but I think the Melt, Hood, and Cities carries enough weight to get the job done. Personally, I like the Worcester shows from yesterday better than the Spectrum shows today, but I wouldn't leave any of those off a top 20 list. Last but not least, I'm glad to see the shoreline show get some love. I think the "highlights" from Deer Creek are better, but Shoreline is more consistent. I would have to agree that it has the best YEM of the year. It loses traction at times, but the pay off is always right around the corner.

Good job gentlemen.
, comment by Choda
Choda @bl002e said:
@Choda said:
Wow. This is turning anti-climatic.
Man, will your face be red when you find out which show placed #1.

[Spoiler]
Hint: It rhymes with "'Pour me wine,' we state."
Good. If it's 11/17 or 12/6 then it's anti-climatic. I can get behind philly just because they were not talked about for years...are they my favorite...no...I agree with @MiguelSanchez that Worcester should be higher.
, comment by n00b100
n00b100 @Dressed_In_Gray said:
@n00b100 said:
Wouldn't be shocked to see 11/19/97 on here, too.

I would. If it is the Top 10, I will be shocked. No way it deserves to be higher than either night of the Went
In that I am in agreement, but that's a moot point now. It wouldn't deserve to be higher (in my estimation) than 7/1, which I would put above 7/2. It wouldn't deserve to be higher than 12/29, or 11/28, or 12/2. But we're running out of shows that would be considered "elite" or worthy of the last ten places, and 11/19 is a show people love, so, again, wouldn't be surprised. The Glastonbury show? 2/23? I'd be surprised.

I think, if anything else, this raises an important point - even the *best*, the very highest years of Phish, have a certain baseline when it comes to great shows, and there's plenty of shows that don't cross that baseline in those years. Which is good - if anyone was trying to argue that, say, 12/9/97 (a perfectly good show!) should be in the same presence as 11/22/97, it would not only look rather foolish, but destroy the entire nebulous concept of "greatness" that's informing this list in the first place. But it also means that a) not every show is 11/22/97, and b) the baseline is not 11/22/97, and never has been. Shit, the baseline's not 12/7/97 either. Worth remembering.
, comment by EdwardGRobinson
EdwardGRobinson I was very interested to see where my first show, 8/10 Deer Creek, was going to land in this list. I recall being very very confused by what was going on for much of Set II. Everyone around me seemed to be nearly as confused, so I was able to blend in. Looking back, that is still one of the "strangest" sets of Phish I ever witnessed. Great read so far. Keep it up!
, comment by bl002e
bl002e @Choda said:
@bl002e said:
@Choda said:
Wow. This is turning anti-climatic.
Man, will your face be red when you find out which show placed #1.

[Spoiler]
Hint: It rhymes with "'Pour me wine,' we state."
Good. If it's 11/17 or 12/6 then it's anti-climatic. I can get behind philly just because they were not talked about for years...are they my favorite...no...I agree with @MiguelSanchez that Worcester should be higher.
In all honesty, I don't know for sure which show(s) placed in the top 10, as I wanted to enjoy the suspense. Spoiler alert: my spoiler text isn't actually a spoiler -- just a poor attempt at humor.
, comment by MiguelSanchez
MiguelSanchez a couple other thoughts:

1) I'm glad some extra emphasis was put on the Went DwD. It is fantastic. I like it A LOT more than the gin that follows. I'd even call it one of my all time favorites.

2) I'm wondering if the last night of Worcester is going to get screwed. That one has some real muscle too.

3) 11/19/97 doesn't make the cut. I can't see how anyone could be on the fence on the Worcester Jim and be for the 11/19 Wolfman's, which is the deal breaker on that show.

4) Personally, I'm not HUGE on 11/22/97. It's good, but it's not a favorite of mine. I prefer 11/21. I'm curious if the "raters" are going to indeed put it in the 1 spot.
, comment by Choda
Choda I have come to appreciate the beauty of 11/22. The 1st set is so 97...that it is shocking but not surprising. The Halley's is amazing...the last 10 minutes are pure bliss. I am a fan of 11/21 because it is some fucked up shit...in a good way...that Bag is mind blowing. By that time we all just figured anything could be jammed on at any moment.

All I know is that 12/30, 12/6, 11/22 and 11/17 will be in the top 10 but I'd really like some surprises: 11/26, 12/13 or 8/9
, comment by MiguelSanchez
MiguelSanchez @Choda said:
I have come to appreciate the beauty of 11/22. The 1st set is so 97...that it is shocking but not surprising. The Halley's is amazing...the last 10 minutes are pure bliss. I am a fan of 11/21 because it is some fucked up shit...in a good way...that Bag is mind blowing. By that time we all just figured anything could be jammed on at any moment.

All I know is that 12/30, 12/6, 11/22 and 11/17 will be in the top 10 but I'd really like some surprises: 11/26, 12/13 or 8/9
I don't know why I hadn't thought of it, but I think 11/26 would be an EXCELLENT dark horse for top 10. The Tweezer opener is every bit as good as the highly touted Denver version. Then there's the 2nd set...
, comment by poster
poster Shoreline 97' is epic for me. Set II is amazing and will always hold a place in my heart. The ending set I YEM is amazing, as is the Jim from the beginning of Set II.

97 was so tight, even when there wasn't an epic jam or heavy funk, it just sounds so perfect. The Vultures & McGrupp are perfect and then we get to the Groove. Mike's was so sinister, just a crazy version that takes me to another place. The Weekapaug may be somewhat standard, but the happy b day is powerful and the ending Can't You Hear Me Knocking jam ending from some of the 97' paug's are always amazing.

97 Phish is the goat, it should be in some musical hall of fame somewhere. :-)
, comment by Choda
Choda @MiguelSanchez said:
@Choda said:
I have come to appreciate the beauty of 11/22. The 1st set is so 97...that it is shocking but not surprising. The Halley's is amazing...the last 10 minutes are pure bliss. I am a fan of 11/21 because it is some fucked up shit...in a good way...that Bag is mind blowing. By that time we all just figured anything could be jammed on at any moment.

All I know is that 12/30, 12/6, 11/22 and 11/17 will be in the top 10 but I'd really like some surprises: 11/26, 12/13 or 8/9
That was my 1st show of fall 97 and that tweezer was the best way to start it off. Melt, Taste, McGrupp...and the 2nd set is the purest segue set of fall. Trey ripcord was distinct and amazing. All these jam ideas bled together.

I don't know why I hadn't thought of it, but I think 11/26 would be an EXCELLENT dark horse for top 10. The Tweezer opener is every bit as good as the highly touted Denver version. Then there's the 2nd set...
, comment by uctweezer
uctweezer I'm glad to see Shoreline at 11. I always felt it was somehow overlooked, despite boasting the best YEM of 1997, an awesome "nod to Jer" and a "nod to Neil" (that certainly didn't hurt their likelihood of invitation to the Bridge School Benefit the next year), and an extremely strong 4th quarter of McGrupp > Mike's -> Hydro > Groove -- emphasis on that strange but awesome segue from Mike's to Hydrogen. And the 2O Jim might be my favorite ever -- it certainly gets more spins than the Woostah Jam in my house. While I'll take the previous night's Bowie -> Cities -> Bowie over anything from 7/31, this show definitely has it all. It was also the first show for many of my high school friends, but apparently their rave reviews went right over my head because it took me two more years to get on the train.
, comment by Dressed_In_Gray
Dressed_In_Gray @MiguelSanchez said:
I can't see how anyone could be on the fence on the Worcester Jim and be for the 11/19 Wolfman's, which is the deal breaker on that show.
Hear hear! Well said!
, comment by classicandsigniture
classicandsigniture Made an account just now to note a factual error on the 8/17/97 review. The third set did not open with Wedge and contain Tweezer, that happened in the first set. They opened set three with an extremely rare Buffalo Bill that featured a flawless segue in to NICU, the set also contains a ragin' Scent of a Mule and Guyute taboot! They definitely did not come out firing blanks on that third set. Seems like this show might have gotten shafted due to some clerical errors on the listeners part.
, comment by MiguelSanchez
MiguelSanchez @Dressed_In_Gray said:
@MiguelSanchez said:
I can't see how anyone could be on the fence on the Worcester Jim and be for the 11/19 Wolfman's, which is the deal breaker on that show.
Hear hear! Well said!
I honestly don't think 11/19 makes my top 10 for fall tour
, comment by andrewrose
andrewrose Well I think these 5 are locks:

12/6
11/17
11/21
11/22
12/30

11/23, 12/11, 7/2 seem likely to make to it too. 12/9?

One show that I'm not sure will make the cut at this pint, but which would have been in my top 20, is 11/14. I love that show.
, comment by sausagemahoney
sausagemahoney @classicandsigniture said:
Made an account just now to note a factual error on the 8/17/97 review. The third set did not open with Wedge and contain Tweezer, that happened in the first set.
That's actually what the review says: "the first set is really only notable for" Tweezer and The Wedge.

They opened set three with an extremely rare Buffalo Bill that featured a flawless segue in to NICU, the set also contains a ragin' Scent of a Mule and Guyute taboot! They definitely did not come out firing blanks on that third set. Seems like this show might have gotten shafted due to some clerical errors on the listeners part.
That's not a clerical error, but it was just, like, our opinion, man.
, comment by uctweezer
uctweezer @sausagemahoney said:
@classicandsigniture said:
Made an account just now to note a factual error on the 8/17/97 review. The third set did not open with Wedge and contain Tweezer, that happened in the first set.
That's actually what the review says: "the first set is really only notable for" Tweezer and The Wedge.

They opened set three with an extremely rare Buffalo Bill that featured a flawless segue in to NICU, the set also contains a ragin' Scent of a Mule and Guyute taboot! They definitely did not come out firing blanks on that third set. Seems like this show might have gotten shafted due to some clerical errors on the listeners part.
That's not a clerical error, but it was just, like, our opinion, man.
I'd also like to note the mathematical error in OP's handle -- in my opinion it's spelled "signature".
, comment by WayIFeel
WayIFeel Really hoping a couple of dark horses like 11/14 (which I think is 6/14/00's doppelganger) or 11/26 sneak into the top 10.
, comment by nichobert
nichobert I don't think I have ever claimed i'd "quit phish.net" for any reason.

But i might quit Phish.net if Denver wins this.

I am terrified Phoenix is going to miss the cut. I have no idea if people realize how good that show is. Especially in comparison to Denver, which I've always felt had one of the rarest distinctions among shows: If set one had two extra songs thrown in as a bonus, it'd lose like 5% of however heady points are calculated.
, comment by nichobert
nichobert Not that i'd kick Denver II out of bed or anything. It's perfectly "standard epic"

I just don't think it cracks my top 10 from 97.

Props to giving 8/10/97 love. The experimental jams from that show have incredible replay value.
, comment by pikepredator
pikepredator @andrewrose said:
Well I think these 5 are locks:

12/6
11/17
11/21
11/22
12/30

11/23, 12/11, 7/2 seem likely to make to it too. 12/9?

One show that I'm not sure will make the cut at this pint, but which would have been in my top 20, is 11/14. I love that show.
I agree with your five locks and would add 08/09.

like a few other people I'm curious to see if 07/25 ends up on the list or not. that might be the mystery 10th show assuming 11/23 (which is not a favorite of mine), 12/11, and 07/02 (love them both) are all on there as well.
, comment by J_D_G
J_D_G Actually, that sentence was confusingly worded and you misread it--I just tweaked it to make it clearer. (And I added a reference to "Buffalo Bill"--good call!) But I assure you, we are all familiar with what was played at the Great Went and when they played it. (And fwiw, we consider a third-set "Scent of a Mule" to be a negative, not a positive.)

@classicandsigniture said:
Made an account just now to note a factual error on the 8/17/97 review. The third set did not open with Wedge and contain Tweezer, that happened in the first set. They opened set three with an extremely rare Buffalo Bill that featured a flawless segue in to NICU, the set also contains a ragin' Scent of a Mule and Guyute taboot! They definitely did not come out firing blanks on that third set. Seems like this show might have gotten shafted due to some clerical errors on the listeners part.
, comment by nichobert
nichobert That third set at the Went is nice and all, it's certainly not firing blanks... But (IMO anyway) it really helps to think of it as being the most jumbo encore ever. That way it's like the most glorious bonus ever instead of an incredibly pedestrian way to cap off a wonderful weekend.

Just curious, is anyone else really underwhelmed by that DWD? I always thought it was fascinating that- to my mind- that set featured one big jam that felt completely uninspired and then immediately followed it up with one of the most inspired pieces of improvisation they've ever done.

I'm sorry if I'm being overly negative. These are just the things that are popping up in my head right now :)
, comment by sausagemahoney
sausagemahoney For me, the idea that 8/17/97 II is Phish's best ever set is highly unpersuasive. The Gin is magnificent of course, and if you say it's your favorite Phish jam ever I wouldn't come to blows with you or anything. But the set is heavily padded, with half the band having to put their instruments down and do paintings. Don't get me wrong: the Trey/Mike and Fish/Page duets are perfectly fine, but in the context of analyzing the best of 1997 they play like filler. The DwD and Hood are not exceptional versions, despite the historical importance and nostalgia of the first serious glowstick war and Trey's speeches. As great as it is, the second set can't really hang with heavy hitters like 7/22 and 11/19 and 12/6. I don't think the show even made my top 20.
, comment by n00b100
n00b100 Just some opinions based on the further discussion:

1. I like 8/16 more than 8/17.
2. I think the DWD is better than @nichobert is giving it credit for, but I don't think it's *that* great. I don't think the Gin is *that* great, either, but more in a "is this the best jam ever" sense; it's definitely a very good jam.
3. 8/17 II is fine; "firing blanks" is overstating it, but it's hard to imagine that people would like that set very much (very good Mule nonwithstanding) if that was their 2nd set.
, comment by pikepredator
pikepredator @n00b100 said:
Just some opinions based on the further discussion:

1. I like 8/16 more than 8/17.
2. I think the DWD is better than @nichobert is giving it credit for, but I don't think it's *that* great. I don't think the Gin is *that* great, either, but more in a "is this the best jam ever" sense; it's definitely a very good jam.
3. 8/17 II is fine; "firing blanks" is overstating it, but it's hard to imagine that people would like that set very much (very good Mule nonwithstanding) if that was their 2nd set.
this exercise is all about the re-listen, but when 08/17 III started reba, bowie, and mike's were still on the table. one of those sets where expectations get in the way of enjoyment.

but man did I LOVE my first live guyute.
, comment by raidcehlalred
raidcehlalred Just curious, is anyone else really underwhelmed by that DWD? I always thought it was fascinating that- to my mind- that set featured one big jam that felt completely uninspired and then immediately followed it up with one of the most inspired pieces of improvisation they've ever done.

I am. It's cool, but I heard it before, and then I saw it again (in other DWDs and within other Jams). The Gin is so cool cause it plays like an enchanting bit from some 10 min Tweezer in 92, or from a Dust in 99; so much fun, and so transcendent, that you follow it with Pen instead of Caspian (which is a fine enough song) cause there is still so much energy.
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